The Times of India Reports:
The Centre on Wednesday sought eight weeks time from the Supreme Court to articulate its view on the vexed issue of reservation for Dalit Christians, who got a favourable report from the Justice Ranganath Mishra Commission. The government’s job was made complex by the recommendation of the National Commission for Scheduled Castes (NCSC) that a quota for Dalit Christians should not eat into the existing 15% share of SCs. In its recommendation to the Centre, NCSC had on September 18, 2007 said: “It was decided that reservation should be extended to them but the share of 15% of SCs should not be disturbed and the element of reservation for these communities (Dalit Christians and Dalit Muslims) should be determined by the government keeping in view their population.”
As this issue festers in the courts, it is important to remember that the recent spate of violence in Orissa’s Kandhamal District was also?rooted in the demand for ST status for Dalit Christians.
So on the basis of what data did the Rangnath Mishra Commission recommend reservations for Dalit Christians ?
Offstumped set about to research the commission but not much on Government of India websites on this subject. The background to the issue is the 2005 Supreme Court request to the National Commission for Religious and Linguistic Minorities, NCRLM to conduct an investigation and complete a report concerning the need for affirmative-action benefits for Dalit Christians and Muslims.?
?On May 22nd 2007 the NCRLM backed the demand for extending reservation benefits to Dalit converts to Christianity and Islam. NCRLM, headed by Justice Rangnath Mishra and comprising Tahir Mahmood, Mohinder Singh and Anil Wilson, had termed the exclusion of Dalits from SC list after conversion out of Hinduism as violative of constitutional guarantee of non-discrimination on religious grounds. The lone dissenter was the panel’s member secretary Asha Das, who argued that extending SC status to Christians and Muslims would amount to inserting caste in religions which don’t recognise it.
It is puzzling that since May when the Commission made its recommendations all we hear from the media are its recommendations and none of the background data which was allegedly the basis for this recommendation. Then in June you had the St. Stephen’s College in New Delhi upping its ante by announcing a 10% reservation for Dalit Christians in an attempt to apply pressure on the Government. In July you had the government beating around the bush on this issue at the Supreme Court. We hear of religious quotas again in September through selective leaks to the media. In October comes the news of NCSC backing the demand but with the quota within quota caveat.
Offstumped Bottomline: As the Congress struggles to have it both ways having created the genie of religious quotas with the setting up of the NCRLM it would be a shame if the already incendiary politics of affirmative entitlement were to be further communalized. Attempts to find casteist divisions in other religious communities are a retrograde step and should call into question the rationale for Caste based?Reservations on the one had and the ethics of Proselytization on the other hand. The Congress will pay a heavy price if it persists with it further persists with its Communal Socialism in the name of quota for Dalit Christians and Muslims.
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Filed under: Uncategorized
Congressi @#$%*!
Yossarin you are doing a sterling job by bringing up and researching matters which though are of national importance are never taken up in the same spirit by the MSM. Offstumped has now become a part of my daily news routine. Keep it up.
Bhanu
Giving reservations for the so called dalit christians and muslims without making changes
in the 15% reservation for SCs is very difficult.
The major criteria for SC status is untouchability
and the resulting lack of access to public places
including places of worship. Is this applicable
to dalit christians and muslims? Are they discriminated so by their brethersn and sisters
of the respective religions. If so then the whole
discourse on caste, religion and untouchability needs a drastic revision, so much so, that no longer Hindus/Hinduism alone can be blamed for practising
untouchability. Are these hindu haters proclaiming themselves to be secularists willing to accept this.
Do we have any statistics about the % and numbers of dalit christians and muslims. I think Census data does not provide that. If so how
to identify them and the respective numbers. Since the commission headed by Bhuta Singh has recommended
reservation in proportion to their share in population in the absence of data that cannot be
implemented.Besides this there are issues like
changes in the SC list and how to identify the
new groups.
First we had the Muslims & the Christians. Now we have the “Dalit” versions of both. Whatever that means. Someone will have to explain me that.
All this seems to be a strategy to make sure that the Congress covers every possible minority as it’s vote bank. It thinks it’s not enough to appease the Musilms & Christians alone. That risked ignoring all the “Dalits” within them. There’s just no end to this, is there? Is it any surprise then all the bright minds migrate from India to places where they can flourish.
On the other hand, the Congress is definately shooting itself in the foot by resorting to such measures. Coupled with it’s indecisiveness on numerous national issues, myopic political views, lack of serious leadership, it is scripting it’s own downfall. More proof of the Congress blindness, Kapil Sibal, on Devil’s Advocate, emphatically denied Rahul Gandhi’s failure in UP/Gujarat & declared that the junior Gandhi will lead Congress in the next general elections. That just might be the last straw for Congress.
>> Christians and Muslims would amount to inserting caste in religions which don’t recognise it.
What is important? the ‘virgin purity’ of religions or providing benefits to people who need it? Dalits are Dalits irrespective of which religion they belong to.
People don’t even understand who Dalits are. Dalits are simply people abandoned by other sections of the Indian society over hundreds of years. Religion has nothing to do with it. Its not unfathomable that one day all Muslims might become eligible for this Dalit ‘status’ considering their dire economic situation and rampant ghettoization of their communities.
And I do know Dalit Converts to Christianity who are refused entry in some Chennai Churches. I also know many Christians (even those training to become priests) who retain their ‘Hindu SC’ caste certificates to get benefits.
you know jackshit comrade balaji. Discrimination doent happen in big city churches. Name those churches, comrade, if you think it does.
Comrade Balaji has uttered “only” one truth.
“I also know many Christians (even those training to become priests) who retain their ‘Hindu SC’ caste certificates to get benefits.”
All the recommendations of this commission is to make the present misuse as legitimate.
This points out what was the reason for backwardness of Dalits as pointed down here.
http://www.organiser.org/dynamic/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=221&page=3
Commie Balaji living with lot of hatred for his own community, you started visiting churches
The real problem is that “Dalit Christians” are going to double-dip. First, they have exclusive rights over other kids in top Christian educational institutions (St Johns Medical, CMC, Loyola, Stephens etc). Next, they will exclude hindu Dalits in the SC quota.
If this happens, the incentive to convert without having to pull off tricks is immense. The poor can tap into billions of dollars of aid money, while getting preference for both their religion and their former caste.
The public might form the impression that Christianity is the preferred state religion as far as ‘fast track’ benefits are concerned.
The Christian community must choose. Dalit Christian quota can happen only if the ‘double dipping’ is prevented. This means all exclusive minority benefits must be cancelled and the state must adopt a truly secular data-driven stance towards social justice.
Anyone game for data ?
rc, I agree with your point most. Reservation is a joke nowadays, even to SC’s and ST’s. Why? Because none of it goes to those intended among backward people. Not to mention ‘strong’ caste groupings have been given SC or ST status in different states when there is absolutely no reason for them to be there. Bottom line, forget reservation for Muslim and Christian “SC’s”…it is time to take Reservation for SC’s and ST’s out and bring India into the 21st century, kicking and screaming. A constitutional amendment protecting India’s diversity by banning constitution in government sector, private sector, educational institutions and of course, elected office. Delimitation Commission has most importantly reserved seats for some fantastic MP’s, now they will be replaced by God knows who…only the constituents will suffer, I suppose!
In response to this latest travesty, I think BJP should agitate to have similar reservation in the army, navy, air force at the highest level, among the pilots who fly the PM and other politicians’ and ministers’ official planes and helicopters, doctors who treat them etc. etc. Let’s go all the way and have reservation at all levels of employment, irrespective of the skills.
*tongue-in-cheek*
u people are not aware of the sufferings undergone by the dalit christians in their day today life.Do u know one thing? A dalit is a dalit whatever religion he belongs to’If there is no caste in christianity why should they ask for it for such a long time.Please help us .just because we worship jesus we are denied the rights. pls think it over deeply before coming to a conclusion.
hey buddy discrmination does occur and the privelages of being associated with being a christian institution are cornered by the so called elitist sections, christianity does not advocate caste but christians do and dalit christians being denied reservation benefits is a violation of equality as enshrined in the constitution.the church too needs to seriously introspect rather than trying to brush things under the carpet, the institution isnt as tidy as it projects it to be . to detractors all we ask is fair play and equality of oppurtunities as enjoyed by everybody
i wd lke to point out to a gentlemen out there that providing reservation to a deserving minority or whoever wd not make india any less secular to put it in perspective let me add that the reservation being demanded is not new its already been enjoyed by their hindu brethern, all demands to social and occupational mobility by less privelaged have faced scorn and bullshittin by vested interests who find the status quo advantageous to their scheme of things
Five Points Election Demand by Dalit Christians
New Delhi: March 27, 2009:- The Poor Christian Liberation Movement (PCLM) strongly condemns interference by the Church in the Lok Sabha election process by declaring that it will field Church candidates. It urges all the political parties to take note of the statement issued by the Kerala Bishop‘s. The PCLM is shocked at the statement and demands that the election commission should issue show cause notice in this matter.
The PCLM makes the following demands to the political parties:
- In view of lot of controversy on conversion the PCLM urges the political parties to commit to bring an all India level Freedom of Religion Bill to check fraudulent and allurement conversion. All political parties must make their stand clear on this point before the elections.
- That the political parties in India should include formation of a Waqf like board for the protection of mission property of heritage nature in India.
- The PCLM urges that no ordained priest or nun should be appointed member of a government commission. Instead lay Christian must be appointed in such bodies. Currently the bishops are appointed by the Vatican and can be removed by the Vatican only. The local bodies or Christians have no say in it. This is undemocratic process. This must be changed.
- Several reports have indicated that large section of poor Christians of Dalit and tribal backgrounds are still suffering from the discrimination, outside and within the Church. So the PCLM demands that a development board for financial and social upliftment of Christians be formed after the elections. The political parties in their manifestoes must indicate their position on this issue.
- The Church in India owns large number of educational and health institutions under minority status. The Church is demanding reservation from the Government for the Dalit Christians .The PCLM demands that the Church must reserve 60 per cent of jobs for the poor Christians in the Christian institutions. It further urges the political parties that in case in any Christian institution the number of Christian’s beneficiaries are less than 50 percent the minority status of such institutions should be cancelled and it must be put “other Charitable Institutions” category.
It has been observed that some individuals are secretly negotiating with the political parties on behalf of the community. The PCLM wants such elements to refrains from nefarious activities.
Issued by R.L. Francis, President, PCLM
http://www.Dalitchristian.org
Poor Christian Liberation Movement (PCLM)
Office:- IIIA/145, Rachana, Vashali – 201010 (NCR) India
Telefax 0120, 4569131 Cell. 9810108046
Email:-francispclm@yahoo.com
PRESS RELEASE
On the eve of Good Friday
Christian urges Church to propagate message of Love
New Delhi, April 9, 2009: All over the world Christians remember Jesus Christ for message of love and forgiveness on the Good Friday but the Church in India is using language of hate and division during the current Lok Sabha election time, acceding to a press release by the Poor Christian Liberation Movement (PCLM).
The PCLM has noted that certain bishops are falsely propogating that Christians in Orissa are not safe therefore the elections there should be postponed. The PCLM differs from such assessment and feels that the Christian churches are creating ill feeling against one particular community and a political party. Such a move is dangerous as it divides the Indian community. Mr. R L Francis, the president of PCLM stressed that some people are falsely propogating such things for their own benefit.
The PCLM urges that the Election Commission should call for an explanation from the Archbishop of Cuttack- Bhubaneswar. Rt. Rev Raphael Cheenath as to why he is propagating in foreign countries that the elections in Kandhamal Orissa should be postponed. The PCLM will also be drawing the attention of Smt. Sonia Gandhi, Congress President, Shri Rajnath Singh, president BJP and other political parties to raise this issue before the Election Commisiosn.
R.L.Francis
President – PCLM
An Open Letter to Hon. Prime Minister of India
http://www.nationalfreepress.org/An-Open-Letter-to-Hon-Prime-Minister-of-India
Dr. Singh
An Open Letter of the Dalit Christians to Hon’ble Prime Minister of India, Indian Parliamentarians and Indian Church Authorities
The Hon’ble Prime Minister,
152, South Block,
New Delhi -110 011
Wish you Happy Christmas and New Year.
For the last several decades, the Indian Church Authorities and its Leaders at National and International level have been subtly pressurizing the Indian Government to make suitable amendments in the Constitution to include converted Dalit Christians in the list of Schedule Castes. Our Constitution founders and framers had seen the validity of assuring equality and respect to Dalit Hindus in their Hindu fold, while they were not clear as to the implications of the same with Dalit Christians.
Hence they formulated the provision for Hindu Dalit reservation for Schedule Caste in the Constitution. The Hindu community as a majority of peoples accepted reservations as a just and fair provision. Thus the Indian constitution gave equal right to the Dalit Hindus because they suffered ill treatment and were oppressed in the society over the centuries. It was a fair and just compensation to the Dalit Hindus for the exploitation done to them.
While Dalit Hindus- who were converted to Christianity- lost their privilege of reservation policy and thus they were not included in the list of Schedule Caste. The Converted Dalit Christians had ‘an historic option’ to decide whether to accept their original religion-Hinduism and return to their community and thus avail the facility of Schedule Caste but most of the Dalit Christians forsook the reservation policy and they decided to remain Dalit Christians (DC) mainly because DCs fondly recalled the words of Jesus Christ: “Come to me, all of you who labor and are burdened, and I will give you rest.” (Mt Ch. 11:28)
Over the decades, the Church Authorities and Leaders belittled the faith of DCs., Besides, the Lords of Christendom- the Bishops, had already condescendingly accepted and treated the DCs as low grade Christians- reminiscent of their ‘original stigma’-untouchables. This subtly implied that DCs should never forget who they were and that it is thanks to valiant, foreign missionaries efforts that they still can be treated as second class followers of Christianity. Thus Church Authorities maintained a clear distinction between ‘those of the earlier accepted the Christian faith and thus possessed a superior grade/class and a superior faith’ and those traits should be preserved till reward day of the Master. Keeping this as a background check, the Indian Church Authorities deemed it fit that Dalit Christians remain uneducated lot, and they were not given proper and equal right for gainful employment least they be filled with a false pride of being true Christians. Notice the subtle distinction and statements of Church authorities when it comes to the game of numbers. DCs who form over 70% of the Christians population should be a’ feather in the cap’ of the numerous foreign missionaries who descended in hordes triumphantly dreaming that one day the whole of India would be Christianized.
Further, the line of thinking of Church Authorities can be described thus: DCs ought to get proper compensation in lieu of governmental benefits they lost is ‘an unchristian consideration’- this would spoil ‘their Christian motivation’. Thus, it was clear to the Bishops and Church Authorities that any such talk of compensation made to DCs is unheard of biblical remedy. Hence DCs should remain poor and despicable to as proof of their newly accepted ‘superior faith’. Moreover, the secular Indian Government should be taught a lesson or two -especially the lesson that it is the ‘duty and responsibility’ of the Indian Government to make appropriate provisions for DCs? And that ‘we the Bishops’ if needed, are ready to fight tooth and nail to see that the Indian Government implements and practices what is enshrined in the Constitution of India. The Government should be blamed squarely because they care two hoots for the plight of the DC while they are pampering the other Dalits with innumerable concessions all for political gain. And why should Church Authorities and leaders make suitable provisions for their own least brethren was beyond the comprehension of the great Lords of Christendom.
In just four hundred years the Christian population grew in leaps and bounds, the Indian Church’s with the selfless efforts of foreign missionaries added millions to the zero percentage of Christians in India. But no Church Authority ever even noticed that the plight of those numerous DCs remained the same. Nay over the decades it worsened. Hence what was and is the primary intention of the pious missionaries becomes clear. Indian Church Authorities and Leaders merely used DCs in a game of numbers and scarcely gave a passing thought to improve the living conditions of DC. The DCs were never or rather deliberately kept out mainstream Christianity and thus they were unable to experience progress and growth in their Christian living even though they had full membership in the various Churches.
Notice this fact, when it came to the ‘battle of equal rights for all Dalits’ the Indian Church Authorities deemed it fit to wage a battle with the mind of Constitution founders and framers. And the battle did begin as early as or as soon as India gained independence. In their heart of hearts the Church Authorities and Leaders wanted that DCs to be loyal Christians and remain faithful members of their respective Churches and yet when it came to the matter of improvement in the standard of living, all their sound reasoning and superior faith failed them. Even an ‘ordinary statements of the assets’ of the Indian Churches- like enumerating the thousands of Christians Schools , Colleges and large compounds, and thousands of other allied majestic institutions like Hospitals and other social work Institutes will show the might of Indian Church wealth. It is well known that Indian Church Authorities have wealth ‘second to none’ in terms of immovable assets and finances. And note – this second to none is in comparison with the Government of India.
Besides, in the name of DCs and poor, the Church gets flooded with funds both from within country and from abroad. And most ironical- the condition of DCs remains as poor as the proverbial Church mouse. Do all these the funds instantaneously disappear into the incredible mouth of Bishop Pip? (Please view the Documentary-’In search of self respect’, produced by PSBT and Prasar Bharti. http://www.syncline films.com). The Mighty Indian Churches have conveniently divided India and with the magical wand of the Pope and other Church Authorities, have created around 250 to 300 dioceses in the country in order to smoothly run and manage their vast properties and institutions. A diocese may have average around fifty thousand followers. Based on their own methods of mission management: aren’t the Indian Church Authorities and Leaders responsible for the sorry state of affair of DCs? Why is the Indian Church constantly harping on the same old tune that Indian secularism is at stake when they themselves like Pilate constantly wash off their hands regarding a sound and just policy of justice for their least brethren- the Dalit Christians( DC)?.
Why are the Church Authorities forcing our Parliamentarians to debate on the scheduled caste status of DCs? It is for all to see who has a hidden agenda. It is for the Church Authorities to honestly provide a ‘white paper’ on their fabulous wealth and what have they done to alleviate the sufferings of the least of their brethren- the Dalit Christians.
To all Indian Bishops
The open letter is now addressed to the Presidents of the Catholic Bishop’s Conference of India, of the National Council for Churches in India, Church of South India, Anglicans, Methodists, CNI, and all Bishops of all Christian Denominations.
Most Rt. Rev. Bishops,
Happy Christmas and New Year,
Over the last several decades, the Catholic Bishops Conference of India, National Council for Churches in India, all the Protestant Churches and all the Christian foreign funding agencies were and are trying their best to amend the legislation of inclusion in Scheduled Caste status for Dalit Christians. You had several ‘ high level meetings and conferences at National and International level; and you were seen frantically appointing the best legal luminaries to see that DC are included in the list of scheduled caste thus securing a new heaven and a new earth for DCs.
It was reported in the newspapers that your Grace and Lordship have graciously come down to the earth in New Delhi- the National Capital on November 29th 2007. You staged a Dharna for inclusion of DCs into Scheduled Caste status. When your Grace and Lordship, and predecessors converted Dalits from the Hindu society, the main attractions offered to them was that there was no caste discrimination in the Christian society and that they would be treated equally as brothers in Christ. It was with this hope of an ‘egalitarian status’ within the Christian community that the poor Dalits converted themselves to Christianity. If they are still Dalits the question is who has been oppressing them of late, it is true that when they were in the Hindu society they were oppressed by caste system that existed in that society. But was it not a solemn pledge before God and man that these converted Christians would be looked after without any discrimination and with Christian love and sharing?
There is an answer to this question. Obviously, it is the Church Authorities and Leaders who are exploiting the DCs. If only the Church Authorities can spend twenty five per cent of the Church income for the welfare of DCs, surely there will be a great change in the lives of DCs. If only the Church Authorities can give fifty percent of employment in their institutions to the DCs we believe that within ten years, all the DCs will have employment. But alas- the Church Authorities only gives all employment to and give important posts to the priests, nuns etc. Notice that you are creating fatted calves and bestowing on them privileges upon privileges to merely a small class of clergy and superior Christians.
You are seeing the speck in the eyes of Constitution founders and framers but fail to see the mote in your own eyes? For centuries the Church Authorities are merely filling up the barns for a minuscular clergy and pampering them into a parasitical life, while you ignore the cries and agonies of the discriminated DCs. For these very poor, Jesus has said, “The spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has chosen me to bring good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim liberty to the captive’s recovery of sight to the blind, to set free the oppressed and announce that the year of remission, reward and restoration. Confer, Luke Chapter 4; 16-19.”
Poor Christian Liberation Movement appeals to the Church Authorities and solemnly asks these questions. Why after converting DCs into the Christian fold you have constantly denied and deprived them of proper education facilities, of just employment, and generous financial support? And why do you not give proper Christian respect for DCs? Why do you not offer equal rights to DCs in the Church life? Why are you constantly using DCs as pawns to show the might of your own Empire and missionary prowess? Why hasn’t the Christian sense of giving compensation to DCs never even once crossed the minds of the all powerful and wealthy Church Authorities? Why are you playing the role of going around the devils ring by leaving DCs to the mercy of Indian Government? Why are you not fulfilling your responsibility toward DCs? You must remember the solemn words spoken to Peter Simon. Jesus said to Peter Simon: “If you love me then take care of my lambs and sheep (St John 21:15-17) .And even St. Paul emphatically said this of himself: that he was imprisoned, that he was beaten many times, faced difficulties, was in odd situations, worked hard, spent sleepless nights, many times without food and water, and besides other things, I am under daily pressure because of my anxiety for all the congregations. Who is weak and I am not weak? (2 Corinthians Ch 11: 23-29). Can all the Bishops honestly say that they have fulfilled their responsibility towards Dalit Christians?
May the all the respected Bishop dare to say- YES. Amen.
Thank you.
Yours in Christ,
R.L. Francis
National President
And all Executive Members of PCLM
Image: Dr. Manmohan Singh, Courtesy of the Government of India
http://india.gov.in/govt/whoswho.php
If the church cannot improve the lot of the people it has assiduously converted to its faith then it should stop converting people immediately. They can’t bash up Hinduism for untouchability yet pratice it covertly in the name of “dalit christians”. Also if the DC’s want reservation, they should convert back to Hinduism.